R&D

T/C Encore in 450b anyone?

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R&D

Postby wildcatter » Sat Jun 06, 2009 9:36 pm

I've got some real Dewsies coming for this forum. For now I'll wet your appetite a little. How about a 450b in a totally modern Double Action that will operate in the 60,000psi+ range? Humm..

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Re: R&D

Postby 17DoubleE » Mon Jun 08, 2009 4:49 pm

That sounds interesting Wildcatter. Are you refering to a double-action revolver? I had been wondering if a large framed revolver would ever be manufactured for the 450 Bushmaster. I thought with the rebated case head that it probably wouldn't happen. Would moon clips (is that the correct term?) be used?
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Re: R&D

Postby wildcatter » Tue Jun 09, 2009 12:49 pm

17DE,
Sho-nuff, a double action. And Moon Clips are the best way to approach the problem. I am head spacing each cylinder, so you can single shoot, so moon clips won't be absolutely necessary, but I am cutting out the cylinder for moon clips anyway, they are the best speed loaders too and moon clips store ammo very well..A semi-auto is pretty much out, the mag well through the hand would be nearly impossible to hang unto, unless you were as big and had the hands of Big Foot. Of course a semi-auto could be made much like a Broom-Handle Mauser (http://www.northwest-denture.com/mauser1896/) and that's not a bad idea, but it's not a pretty weapon and sales go best to the pretty guns,right, but hey, you and I would love them..A Broom-Handle 450 Bushmaster, using M16 mags, has a ring to it doesn't it? It'd be an expensive rig, but Holy Cow!! HEY, come to think of it how about a, http://www.bushmaster.com/catalog_carbo ... 15P97S.asp , and I have made them with NO Buffer Tube and with an optional; side folding stock..Humm
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Re: R&D

Postby 2zero6 » Fri Aug 07, 2009 11:15 pm

wildcatter wrote:HEY, come to think of it how about a, http://www.bushmaster.com/catalog_carbo ... 15P97S.asp , and I have made them with NO Buffer Tube and with an optional; side folding stock..Humm


That would be awesome as a 10.5" Alan Zitta piston driven sidefolder using Alan Zitta's stock they are using on the new para rifle
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Re: R&D

Postby 2zero6 » Mon Aug 10, 2009 12:35 am

2zero6 wrote:
wildcatter wrote:HEY, come to think of it how about a, http://www.bushmaster.com/catalog_carbo ... 15P97S.asp , and I have made them with NO Buffer Tube and with an optional; side folding stock..Humm


That would be awesome as a 10.5" Alan Zitta piston driven sidefolder using Alan Zitta's stock they are using on the new para rifle



Reason for the Zitta folding stock design would be to eliminate the buffer system and be able to mount this:

Http://www.nokick.com/Mesa_Tactical_LEO_Recoil_Stock_Kit_for_Rem_870_p/mesa%20tactical%2092240.htm

http://www.nokick.com/Enidine_Shot_Shock_p/mesa%20tactical%2092170.htm

Image
Image



Might help those wanting to reduce some felt recoil. What do you think Widcatter?
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Re: R&D

Postby wildcatter » Mon Aug 10, 2009 8:57 am

2zero6 wrote:
2zero6 wrote:
wildcatter wrote:HEY, come to think of it how about a, http://www.bushmaster.com/catalog_carbo ... 15P97S.asp , and I have made them with NO Buffer Tube and with an optional; side folding stock..Humm


That would be awesome as a 10.5" Alan Zitta piston driven sidefolder using Alan Zitta's stock they are using on the new para rifle



Reason for the Zitta folding stock design would be to eliminate the buffer system and be able to mount this:

Http://www.nokick.com/Mesa_Tactical_LEO_Recoil_Stock_Kit_for_Rem_870_p/mesa%20tactical%2092240.htm

http://www.nokick.com/Enidine_Shot_Shock_p/mesa%20tactical%2092170.htm

Image
Image



Might help those wanting to reduce some felt recoil. What do you think Widcatter?


Your idea has allot of merit. I have used these shocks for long years now, mostly in Bolt Gun applications, where weight is not the prime consideration, as the one I use are industrial shock absorbers used primarily in Robotics and are quite heavy, but these are probably not so.. Anything that spreads the recoil out over a long period of time will work to reduce felt recoil, but a lead-sled in the field just doesn't work so well, but this shock, with your folding stock design ideas, might be an all around solution worth considering...humm
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Re: R&D

Postby 2zero6 » Mon Aug 10, 2009 3:26 pm

Only reason it came to mind was reading about how the 450 recoiled like a 20 guage. This would eliminate any of the problems that people are having with the enidine's recoil arrestor in the buffer system because it would not be a part of the buffer system. I'm sure you already know all of this. Not only that but with all the aftermarket stocks out there you would be able to have all sort of adjustablility with LOP and Comb height As well as being able to use it as a folding stock. Cant wait to see some of the cool ideas you have come to fruition. Sorry for delving so far off the original topic of pistols. :ugeek:
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Re: R&D

Postby MOUNTIN DU » Mon Aug 10, 2009 6:44 pm

After a short discussion with the techs at Bushmaster, I'll be getting (on Wednesday) their M16 buffer and spring with an Accu-wedge to soften recoil and buffer the metal/metal slap of the upper on the lower during cycling. They also offer a hydraulic buffer, but it is better for the gun than the shooter!
Both will slow the cycle rate though... :? like I'm really gonna be bump firing that many rounds :roll:
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Re: R&D

Postby 2zero6 » Mon Aug 10, 2009 10:15 pm

MOUNTIN DU wrote:After a short discussion with the techs at Bushmaster, I'll be getting (on Wednesday) their M16 buffer and spring with an Accu-wedge to soften recoil and buffer the metal/metal slap of the upper on the lower during cycling. They also offer a hydraulic buffer, but it is better for the gun than the shooter!
Both will slow the cycle rate though... :? like I'm really gonna be bump firing that many rounds :roll:


I currently am running the milspec carbine buffer tube/spring and buffer, as well as the accuwedge and have been looking at the enidine hydraulic buffer but I have heard some bad stuff about it causing cycling issues(at least w/5.56 unsure of .450) so I have been trying to figure a way out of seperating the recoil reduction system from buffer system. I love this thing with a collapsible stock (folding and collapsible would be cooler IMO). If all else fails I will probably just get the spikes tactical buffer.

http://www.spikestactical.com/z/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=104_97&products_id=201
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Re: R&D

Postby BD1 » Tue Aug 11, 2009 7:11 am

I'm running a Standard A-2 stock with the enidine buffer and an accuwedge. The only cycling issues I've experienced have been due to the stock weight jamming the buffer tube and an occasional jam caused by the brass catcher. My rifle is at about 700 rounds to date. With the stock weight bolted in place bench sessions of 60 to 100 rounds are no problem. I don't really see the issue with slowing the cyclic rate a little as long as it cycles faster than you can get back on target. I had even thought about adding a bolt carrier weight to slow the cyclic rate a bit more to make life a little easier on the brass with the full house 300 grain loads.
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