Hornady's new bullets

[Weapon of Choice]

We're not talking about a special bullet for the Condor Zone. We're talking about a non lead (copper) bullet that is legal for use in the condor zone just like all the rest of the lead free bullets for other calibers offered buy Barnes and other companies.

Forget the Condor Zone. The law is not about saving Condors anyway. It's just another easy "green" scam science, easy to sell to public, reason for banning a whole class of bullets. The anti gunners here struck gold with it here. They plan to, (have already tried once) and probably will convince the unknowing and uncaring greater public to ban lead ammo in the whole state.

Actually, I'm going to take a look at the 200 XPB. It's designed to expand at 1700 fps. The question is will it over expand and shear petals at closer ranges like 50-75 yards where it will be going way over 1700fps even with a mv of 2300fps. It will also be less likely to jump the crimp.

[wildcatter]

Weapon of Choice, do you expect the primary ranges to be under 100yds? If so, does slowing down the 200xpb to a muzzle velocity of say, 2000fps, make any sense?? ..t

[Weapon of Choice]

Weapon of Choice, do you expect the primary ranges to be under 100yds? If so, does slowing down the 200xpb to a muzzle velocity of say, 2000fps, make any sense?? ..t

I think the average shots are going to be 80-100 yards. I would not be surprised to get shots from 100-200 but I hope to be able to take closer shots. I have not hunted hogs in this area before so I am just guessing based on the area.

So, the point is I don't want to load them down. I want to be able to take a hog at 200 yards provided I have the right shot.

[wildcatter]

Weapon of Choice, do you expect the primary ranges to be under 100yds? If so, does slowing down the 200xpb to a muzzle velocity of say, 2000fps, make any sense?? ..t

I think the average shots are going to be 80-100 yards. I would not be surprised to get shots from 100-200 but I hope to be able to take closer shots. I have not hunted hogs in this area before so I am just guessing based on the area.

So, the point is I don't want to load them down. I want to be able to take a hog at 200 yards provided I have the right shot.

Ok, I'm starting to get the picture, sometimes I need to hear it several ways, before I realize what's going on. Next time just get out a fly swatter and give me a Swat..

You do have a narrow window of use. Let's see, you need a no-lead bullet, that is capable of 200yds with a quick kill, can't over expand at the closer ranges, but must preform well, from say, 0-200yds. Something the normal bullets in much lessor calibers just aren't quite capable of, humm.

Just a thought, based on the following premise,.."the 45cal, at rest, is larger in diameter than expanded 30cal". Even a 375cal hardly ever expands to .4515". Seems you can have your cake and eat it too, in my mind, if you throw out the window, that you just have to have an expansion 45cal bullet. Let me explane. Always in the past, well before the advent of high performance 45cal bullets, one actually needed an expansion bullet, to be able to do more damage in it's wound channel. Right? Now however, I for one, no longer care about expansion. Terminal performance with a non-expanding 45cal bullets out-kill any expanded 30cal or 338 or even the venerable 375cal. I can and do make this statement from some 20+++ years of Professional Hunting, after seeing everything there is to shoot, shot thousands of times. So, this being said, my thought is, don't worry about petals or expansion or anything that can happen to a high speed 45cal bullet, get any qualifying 45cal bullet for your area of choice and go kill the thing that needs a little killing. If you need something that might be a little better than some of the other choices, then get a LBT style solid and hunt "Everything" with perfect success. If you do choose a bullet that at close ranges shears off the nose or the petals lay down beside the bullet body, or it fails in any other way that is totally unacceptable, by normal standards associated in lessor calibers, even in that failed state, your only worry, with your Hi-Performance 45, is how far the drag is going to be, because dead in it's tracks, is dead. What I'm trying to say is, all of the things we've had to worry about, terminally speaking, are all gone now. A Hi-performance 45cal bullet will over come any marginality as I always say.."when the shots are marginal and they Always seem marginal, take enough gun". Your choice of the 450 Bushmaster, will surprise you beyond your belief, no mater what bullet you put in it. We can argue the relative differences, we can see how many Angels we can fit on the head of a needle, but the bottom line is this, even the wrong zero-lead 45cal hi-speed bullet, will kill anything you need to kill in your area, and this with startling aplomb. The Bushmeister has said it best and I often quote him .."I know longer need tracking skills".

What I hope to finally read is, what bullet you finally think is best, that you killed a twenty point buck, how well was the kill, what was the over-all performance of that bullet, and would you use it again or why you think another style of bullet is better.

In the mean time, keep this debate going. I bet you'll choose the right bullet for you and I bet it kills just fine..t

[Weapon of Choice]

Wlidcatter, thanks for your response. I think I am the one who needed to be slapped. What you say makes perfect sense. I want to work up a load with the Barnes 200 grain XPB and give it try. Any ideas on what charge of Lil'Gun I should start with?

[BillytheKid]

Question; is the Condor Zone that desirable to hunt in and can more standard bullets be used in other areas of CA?

Because the "propeller heads" have passed their "no lead bullet in the Condor Zone" laws, that area is becoming more and more over run with wild hogs. Yes, other areas of California are allowed use of lead containing bullets, but that doesnt stop the pig bomb problem in the C-zone.

The true answer is to repeal the "green" laws, but stuffing that genie back into it's bottle isn't likely.

Bill

[wildcatter]

Wlidcatter, thanks for your response. I think I am the one who needed to be slapped. What you say makes perfect sense. I want to work up a load with the Barnes 200 grain XPB and give it try. Any ideas on what charge of Lil'Gun I should start with?

I don't really have allot of experience with lil gun, but there are some serious powder-heads, that hang in these parts and they'll be along soon, with the answer.

I'm really curious about that particular 200 grainer myself. I'll be on the look out for your assessments and will read them with great interest..t

[Hoot]

Wlidcatter, thanks for your response. I think I am the one who needed to be slapped. What you say makes perfect sense. I want to work up a load with the Barnes 200 grain XPB and give it try. Any ideas on what charge of Lil'Gun I should start with?

35gr of Lil Gun with either the Winchester Small Rifle primer, or Remington 7 1/2 (my preference) will get you going and leave you some headroom to experiment with. Try seating such that one of the grooves is right where the taper crimp lies and you'll have all the neck tension you need. If it wasn't going to be only in the teens here, I'd work up something using the 200gr XPB over the Thanksgiving long weekend for you. As a victim of Raynaud's Syndrome, I'm hibernating until April now.

If you are good at consistency, you can additionally take a sheet of toilet paper. Separate the two plies. Take a 450b case and using any method you choose, sharpen the mouth of the case. Use it to cut out disks from the toilet paper sheet (takes some practice). Drop your charge and tap the case down to lightly tamp down the charge. Using tweezers, insert the toilet paper disk over the powder flat. Fill the airspace between the top of the charge and the base of the bullet with some grits or cream of wheat. You get more consistent groups. Make up just enough to shoot this season as the fillers are hygroscopic over time. Cut my groups and SD's in half off the bench rest. I haven't had an adverse effect from the hygroscopic thing, but I do believe in listening to people more experienced then me. Otherwise you can skip that step if you choose.

Hoot

[xxInfidelxx]

I sent in a email to Hornady to ask about any new factory load rounds or new bullets to reload. Here is what I got back today.






From: Steve Hornady





Right now we don't have anything in development but that doesn't mean we don't agree with you, we just haven't had time. We'll see what '12 brings.







From: Hornady Manufacturing, Inc [mailto:webmaster@hornady.com]
Sent: Sunday, November 21, 2010 12:28 AM
To: sales
Subject: "Product Availability Inquiries" Contact from Daniel xxxxxxxxxx



This is a response sent by Daniel xxxxxxxxxx using the feedback form on the website. The details of the message follow below:


Comments:
Was curious when and if you plan on offering any more loads in .450 Bushmaster or at least more bullet options in .452 caliber. I have just started to hunt and would like some more options and right now your 250gr load seems to be the only available choice on the market. Remington is supposed to have a new load "coming soon". Myself and many other at 450bushmaster.net are very excited about this cartridge and await more options from you in the future.

[BillytheKid]

Now, see, when I sent in the email form, asking specifically for non lead bullet in .450 bushmaster, they told me, in effect, 'wait til Dec 2010'

I am very disappointed.