Accuracy issues

[Hopalong]

I've been trying to get some successful loads together for my 450. With as much information as this site has, you'd think it would be easy. And it would be easier, probably, if I used proven loads/components. But I like to try different stuff (just an ornery streak I guess) and so haven't had much success.
So, I've tried those blem bullets from Midsouth. 300 grain JSP bullets of unknown manufacture, I posted a pic awhile back. With low to moderate loads of AA1680, they don't shoot well, 3" or so at 100 yards. Average velocity is around 1700 fps, but variation is ±100 fps. With a good taper crimp to .476. I've got a few left, as the last time out gale force winds interrupted my shoot. So I think I'll add a stab crimp to a few and see if I can get more velocity consistency. I'd love to get a good load with these as they are so cheap, relatively speaking.
I also tried the COP 225 grain solid copper. Used a mild load of Lil Gun, a few each with taper crimps and stab crimps. Great velocity, 2200 fps and not much variation with either type of crimp, ±25 fps. Lousy accuracy, though, 6" or so at 100 yd. Most of the bullets seem to be .451 or so, which may be part of it.
So, I think I'm going to have to try some of the 225 grain FTX bullets over some Lil Gun (or some factory ammo...) to see if I can generate some reasonable accuracy or if I need to start checking something besides my loading technique. 
Any other thoughts on what I've done? Thanks.
Hop

[Hoot]

Remove the variables and see what kind of accuracy You, Your loads and Your rifle are capable of. 225 FTX Rem 7 1/2 and 38 of Lil Gun is a known performer with my 20" barrel. When I'm feeling like something is wrong with my platform, that's what I reach for.

Hoot

[Hopalong]

Remove the variables and see what kind of accuracy You, Your loads and Your rifle are capable of. 225 FTX Rem 7 1/2 and 38 of Lil Gun is a known performer with my 20" barrel. When I'm feeling like something is wrong with my platform, that's what I reach for.

Hoot

Thanks Hoot, kinda what I needed. Will my 16" barrel change have any/much effect?

Hop

[Hoot]

Remove the variables and see what kind of accuracy You, Your loads and Your rifle are capable of. 225 FTX Rem 7 1/2 and 38 of Lil Gun is a known performer with my 20" barrel. When I'm feeling like something is wrong with my platform, that's what I reach for.

Hoot

Thanks Hoot, kinda what I needed. Will my 16" barrel change have any/much effect?

Hop

Quite honestly, I don't know Hop. Never shot a 16 inch model. I'm sure many members have shot the 225gr FTX from their 16s though. Just need to hear from them. It's a fairly stable load across a range of velocities. No reason to expect them to suddenly do poorly. I've loaded them as high as 41gr, so if you feel you need to equal the 20" velocity, load some with 39.5gr as well. Quickload says that will bring the velocity up to what a 20" achieves with 38gr.

Hoot

[PRKL8R]

Hop, Hoot is right. I and a friend have 16'' barrels. They both shoot realy well with 39grs. Little Gun , Rem 7 1/2's. Be sure to seat to just about cover the conelure and taper crimp to .476. Can't go wrong. PRKL8R

[pitted bore]

Hopalong-
Have any of your reloads demonstrated good accuracy? If so, drop back and try a good one again, just to establish that your rifle is free from problems.

If none of your reloads has produced good accuracy, then trying some Hornady factory loads might be in order, again to prove your rifle is working well. With a scope from a bench, most 450B rifles can produce groups of one inch, center to center, for 3 shots with Hornady ammo.

Keep us informed.
--Bob

[Hopalong]

Hopalong-
Have any of your reloads demonstrated good accuracy? If so, drop back and try a good one again, just to establish that your rifle is free from problems.

If none of your reloads has produced good accuracy, then trying some Hornady factory loads might be in order, again to prove your rifle is working well. With a scope from a bench, most 450B rifles can produce groups of one inch, center to center, for 3 shots with Hornady ammo.

Keep us informed.
--Bob

Yeah trying some factory ammo makes the most sense in the short then some of the recommended 225 FTX loads.

Hop

[wildcatter]

Hop, as much as you like to play, this habit isn't going to get you where you want to be and we can no-longer just plink, any more, as we don't know when a resupply will come in. So, my suggestion is to reaffirm what has already been said here and standardize your loads. Shooting Factory will give you a Rum-Line to work against, then if you have problems you can start to segregate the variables and come up with the cure. And you might want to not worry so much about 3 MOA as that is still well with-in a Pigs shoulder (9" @ 300yds) and you have enough on the bullet, to still be able to decide any issue even at 300yds. If we had the clock turned back to last November we could work out all the bugs, but Now, just try finding more bullets, powder, brass, and worst of all Primers..

..t

[Hopalong]

Hop, as much as you like to play, this habit isn't going to get you where you want to be and we can no-longer just plink, any more, as we don't know when a resupply will come in. So, my suggestion is to reaffirm what has already been said here and standardize your loads. Shooting Factory will give you a Rum-Line to work against, then if you have problems you can start to segregate the variables and come up with the cure. And you might want to not worry so much about 3 MOA as that is still well with-in a Pigs shoulder (9" @ 300yds) and you have enough on the bullet, to still be able to decide any issue even at 300yds. If we had the clock turned back to last November we could work out all the bugs, but Now, just try finding more bullets, powder, brass, and worst of all Primers..

..t

Yeah, on some levels I can see the reasoning for not doing too much on the load development front. I hate to buy into the current hysteria, but sadly it exists. It's bad when you can't get common parts for the AR platform, but borders on idiotic when all the big suppliers are out of stuff like primers or 357 brass and other more garden variety materials.
A 3" group at 100 yards is "good enough" for most critters I'd shoot with the 450, that's really about the range I had in mind when I bought the gun. And I have better choices for prairie dogs or something bigger out beyond 250 yards.

Hop

[wildcatter]

Hop, as much as you like to play, this habit isn't going to get you where you want to be and we can no-longer just plink, any more, as we don't know when a resupply will come in. So, my suggestion is to reaffirm what has already been said here and standardize your loads. Shooting Factory will give you a Rum-Line to work against, then if you have problems you can start to segregate the variables and come up with the cure. And you might want to not worry so much about 3 MOA as that is still well with-in a Pigs shoulder (9" @ 300yds) and you have enough on the bullet, to still be able to decide any issue even at 300yds. If we had the clock turned back to last November we could work out all the bugs, but Now, just try finding more bullets, powder, brass, and worst of all Primers..

..t

Yeah, on some levels I can see the reasoning for not doing too much on the load development front. I hate to buy into the current hysteria, but sadly it exists. It's bad when you can't get common parts for the AR platform, but borders on idiotic when all the big suppliers are out of stuff like primers or 357 brass and other more garden variety materials.
A 3" group at 100 yards is "good enough" for most critters I'd shoot with the 450, that's really about the range I had in mind when I bought the gun. And I have better choices for prairie dogs or something bigger out beyond 250 yards.

Hop

Just a thought, even if you miss a prairie dog, by the MOA margin described, you are prolly going to kill it any way. The dirt kicked up by the bullet is supersonic, to say maybe a foot or two, which is dangerous for the dogs..

..t