Geez...I'm such a noob:(

[Outdoored]

Almost there....chronograph on the way ....my question before I start reloading.....should all of my once-fired cases (Hornandy) be the EXACT length? I measured every one....the vast majority of cases fall in the 1.690-1.698 range, but a few of them fall in the 1.682-1.689 range. Common sense tells me that the exact case length on every case will lead to more consistent taper crimps and seating depths, hence.....greater consistency; But, should I trim the majority of my cases down to 1.685 or just leave those out until my brass shortens? My main concern is safety of course....I don't want the majority of my cases to be too short. Also...what is the minimum case length you have found to be the limit?

Thanks guys....just new to reloading and I'm taking it very slow and tedious....I'm a stickler for detail. Cutting my teeth on the 450.

[wildcatter]

I guess it depends on your mission. Do you want Match accuracy or Grizzle accuracy, both will get the job done.

Myself, those cases are in the spec., and I personally would find them acceptable, unless I was trying to hit very small targets at very long ranges. Which make defining the mission all that much more important. If 200yd deer is all the mission requires, then 4 moa is acceptable, you will be half that or less, with those cases..

..t

[Outdoored]

Thanks.....the primary purpose is deer and hogs out to 175....and the occasional water jug at 100

[wildcatter]

Well then, if you want to see one holers at 175yds, then keeping everything samey-samey is important, if you just want to kill your animals, with deadly aplomb, then 2 moa +- will be great and the lengths you have described, will get that job done very well indeed, assuming you choose the right load and bullets. Heck, you can screw the pooch, with crummy loads (but safe) and still get the job done, this is a very forgiving platform for the Hunter..

..t

[Outdoored]

As far as loads...I have a BUNCH of 225g ftx (about 700) about 500 250g FTX, around 300 200g FTX, and 6-700 240g XTP mag.......5 lbs of lil gun.....and different primers. I'm a one hole type of guy usually:) .....so I believe I'll trim most everything to 1.690...the majority of cases fall there or slightly above that....and I'll leave the shorter ones for future use and load development.

[Hoot]

As far as loads...I have a BUNCH of 225g ftx (about 700) about 500 250g FTX, around 300 200g FTX, and 6-700 240g XTP mag.......5 lbs of lil gun.....and different primers. I'm a one hole type of guy usually:) .....so I believe I'll trim most everything to 1.690...the majority of cases fall there or slightly above that....and I'll leave the shorter ones for future use and load development.

You are correct in that the overall length of the re-sized cases impacts the degree of crimp afforded by the taper crimp, though not as drastically as you might imagine. They continue to shrink beyond the first firing, though the degree of additional shrinkage drops each subsequent shooting. Wait until after the second or third firing to trim if you must trim. I don't trim and I get some great accuracy. Mostly from other efforts to minimize variation between rounds. I go to extreme, perhaps questionable lengths to get my reloads as consistent as possible. I do sort them by length and when I reload for an outing, I do my 5-shot strings from five cases of similar length. I tried trimming them the first time out and the SD's were still in the 20-30's using just the taper crimp. The larger, heavier, slower payloads this caliber shoots seems to negate velocity SD's much more so than smaller, lighter, faster calibers. I call it the Mortar Effect. The forgiving nature of this caliber makes all of us appear more skilled downrange than we really are. That having been said. If you do all your load workup data gathering from shooting at 100 yards, that also minimizes the impact of velocity SD. At 300 yards, I'd expect to see a greater impact.

Hoot

[Outdoored]

I get great groups using the factory ammo (hornandy) at 100, so if I can match that, I'll be meeting my goal.....5 shot 1 inch groups is more than sufficient for my uses....which are shots out to 150 on hogs and whitetail........maybe.....maybe when I learn the ballistics and pair it with my Leupy ballistic reticle on the thumper I will try for farther distances......but I have my ARP 6.8 for that.....as well as the trusty 2506, .270, 3006, and .300.

You just can't have too many rifles........

[wildcatter]

I get great groups using the factory ammo (hornandy) at 100, so if I can match that, I'll be meeting my goal.....5 shot 1 inch groups is more than sufficient for my uses....which are shots out to 150 on hogs and whitetail........maybe.....maybe when I learn the ballistics and pair it with my Leupy ballistic reticle on the thumper I will try for farther distances......but I have my ARP 6.8 for that.....as well as the trusty 2506, .270, 3006, and .300.

You just can't have too many rifles........

Just noticing something you said about one-holers. Think about that for a second..a "one holer" in a 45cal!! This thing of ours is really quite incredible, one hole groups!! Does the 45-70 do this? I think not. And we nose out the 45-70, in any category you care to compare.

We have come to expect this "One-Hole" Phenomenon. I can remember Gun-Rag articles (I bet you've read them too), written in the near past, extolling the Holy-Grail as being a one inch (1) group, and we do that normally, now don't we? Yet we have become sort of Blasé about such matters. But thinking it over, HOLY COW, 1 moa and a Steam-Roller to boot!!

Hoot? What is the best accuracy you've gotten to-date? When I am actually trying for group size I will always see 1 MOA +-.
I have seen sub .5 MOA, but this is unusual and is about as common 3moa, which 3moa is my usual outside "Blown Group" size and is still 9" at three hundred (300) yards (shooting an 18" heart/lung area of a adult deer), with PLENTY of residue power to decide any issue at that range and this size group (3" @ 100yds) is quite unusual. Heck! I can pull the shot, yielding 20MOA @ 100yds and still bowl-over a whitetail!

Now, I don't want to admit it, but I have blown the shot, on a running whitetail and hit the animal through the Quarter-Panels at something in the 225yd area and Bowled-Over the animal. Shooting for the heart/lung area and hitting the rear legs? What is that, a miss of about 25" or so. That's about a moa of what, 56.25 MOA and it still killed the animal, immediately!! Now, I'm not saying to do any of this, but it points up the possibilities, even when I screw-up..

..t

[commander faschisto]

WC...misses the occasional shot????....OMG!!!

[Hoot]

...snip...Hoot? What is the best accuracy you've gotten to-date? ...snip.....
...t

To date, my best 5-shot groups come from 225gr FTX over 38gr Lil Gun using Rem 7 1/2 primers with a taper crimp into the cannelure.

This is about as consistent as I can get at 100 yds using an AR platform:

best450group.jpg (48.97 KiB) Viewed 9532 times

That's a half inch grid.

I would be surprised with that particular load if I could not keep 5-shot groups consistently inside an inch at 100 yds off of a bench. That represents an ideal situation rarely afforded when actually hunting. I've had deer opportunities that due to the situation, required me the thread my shot between trees. In that circumstance, any accuracy I can build into my loads is less of an opportunity for failure. So, I strive and strive...

Hoot