Powder available

[Smooth]

Graf & Sons has HODGDON LIL' GUN in 4lb & 8lb.

http://www.grafs.com/retail/catalog/pro ... uctId/5607

[pitted bore]

For the record, to remind ourselves in a couple of years about the current problems of supply:

As of Friday AM, 22 March 2013, Grafs shows Lil'Gun as "out of stock" in all container sizes, 1-, 4-, and 8-lb jugs. In fact, the only smokeless Hodgdon powder they have in stock is Titewad in 14-oz containers, and US869 in 1- and 8-lb containers. For normal reloading of the 450B, Titewad is too fast and 869 too slow.

Grafs does have black powder substitutes in stock. It might be fun to see what sort of velocities can be obtained with the 450B using Pyrodex or 777. I'd be tempted to try it, but the local range is buried under about 40 inches of snow.

--Bob

[LlindeX]

Wildcatter,

Per the statement above: Have you tried any, or do you know of any, attempts to utilize the Black Powder substitutes (Pyrodex, 777, etc.) in 450B loads? If so, what methods were used and what were the results? (Other than the smokescreen). Were any shooters or their firearms harmed in the process of the testing?

[pitted bore]

LlindeX-
I expect loading a 450B with black powder or a BP substitute would be very similar to the results obtained with the 45 Black Powder Magnum. The 45 BPM is simply a 460 S&W case loaded with BP and a suitably short bullet for use in a cartridge-converted Colt Walker.

Here's a link to the wikipedia entry: wikipedia 45 BPM.

The 460 S&W and 450B cases have about the same capacity. I just checked a 450B case with Goex FFFg and it appears it can hold about 57 grains with slight compression. I need to check with some of my BPCR friends about potential problems shooting jacketed bullets with the smokey-type powder. It should not be a problem, because the old British BP express rifles used jacketed bullets.

Just for fun, I would like to try some BP and PB-substitute powders in one of my bolt guns, but the project will have to wait until the range loses about 3 feet of snow. (It's snowing now ! The NOAA weather forecast calls for snow on four of the next five days !!)

--Bob

[Hoot]

QL can't help with this one unless Trailboss is close in performance to Pyrdex. In which case, you're looking at about 1350fps with 100% fill and a 250gr FTX.

Hoot

[wildcatter]

Wildcatter,

Per the statement above: Have you tried any, or do you know of any, attempts to utilize the Black Powder substitutes (Pyrodex, 777, etc.) in 450B loads? If so, what methods were used and what were the results? (Other than the smokescreen). Were any shooters or their firearms harmed in the process of the testing?

You certainly can use any powder and make the Gun go Boom. The trick is to use normal safety procedures and make the weapon function. BP is way to fast and wont function the action, without some mods you are not going to want to perform..

..t

[Hoot]

This is a little off topic, but I just was given a gallon jug of WCC844 by a coworker who is getting out of the reloading business. He kept it in his unheated, non air conditioned Minnesota garage. Is this strictly a no-go situation, or can it be re-characterized using existing 5.56x45 load data minus 10%? Hate to dump it in the garden unless I absolutely have to.

Thanks,

Hoot

[pitted bore]

... The trick is to use normal safety procedures and make the weapon function. BP is way to fast and wont function the action, without some mods you are not going to want to perform. ...

T-
Well, perhaps that's true of those new-fangled semi-autos you play with. That's why I wrote about my planned experiment: "Just for fun, I would like to try some BP and PB-substitute powders in one of my bolt guns ..."

Unless the black powder load breaks my shoulder, I shouldn't have any problems with keeping a bolt action functional.

<GRIN>

However, my barrels have the usual shallow grooves for shooting smokeless loads with jacketed bullets, so whatever accuracy there is initially will probably be degraded rapidly by BP fouling. We'll see.

--Bob

[wildcatter]

... The trick is to use normal safety procedures and make the weapon function. BP is way to fast and wont function the action, without some mods you are not going to want to perform. ...

T-
Well, perhaps that's true of those new-fangled semi-autos you play with. That's why I wrote about my planned experiment: "Just for fun, I would like to try some BP and PB-substitute powders in one of my bolt guns ..."

Unless the black powder load breaks my shoulder, I shouldn't have any problems with keeping a bolt action functional.

<GRIN>

However, my barrels have the usual shallow grooves for shooting smokeless loads with jacketed bullets, so whatever accuracy there is initially will probably be degraded rapidly by BP fouling. We'll see.

--Bob

Hey Doc, with a bolt gun, your only safety concern is pressure. You won't have to worry about the action holding open on the last shot. I have fooled around with bp and it's exceedingly fun, but these days I don't shoot for fun, resupply is a major problem..

..t

[Smooth]

Just noticed that Powder Valley has HODGDON LILGUN in 1 and 8 pound.

http://www.powdervalleyinc.com/index.html