Found an accurate and cheap bullet option

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Re: Found an accurate and cheap bullet option

Postby Hoot » Sat Mar 11, 2017 8:08 pm

Bmt85 wrote:Couple of questions - What's the actual diameter of these bullets? Also, how much bearing surface do they have?

As far as crimping, I usually go .474-.476 depending on what I'm doing. Pretty sure Hoot experimented with taper crimping, and found you can go well past that (I want to say into the low .46's) and still headspace properly. Slowly take it down and thunk test each time.


Since they don't have a cannelure, don't go below .476 crimp. There will plenty of time to investigate outside the nine dots once you've got some time under your belt with this caliber.

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Re: Found an accurate and cheap bullet option

Postby engineer40 » Mon Mar 13, 2017 5:51 pm

I have some good news... and I have some better news!

Just thought I'd update this thread. I loaded up 20 more rounds today with this same 230gr JHP from Everglades. All bullets held together fine still! Every one of them went straight through the target, no key holing or flying apart.

After polishing the lips of the magazine, I had zero failures to feed today. That makes me very happy!


I also loaded my ammo with a new idea on crimping. I wrote about it here.
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=15219&p=52202#p52202

Hope this helps!
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Re: Found an accurate and cheap bullet option

Postby engineer40 » Mon Mar 13, 2017 6:01 pm

Next I think I need to try some IMR4227 and some H110 instead of Lil Gun. Hopefully I can find an accurate load with one of the alternative powders. Now that I have a cheap way to blast through a bunch of ammo with my 450BM, I'm nervous about the toll I've read that Lil Gun can take on barrels.

Do you guys think the Lil Gun burning out barrels is Internet folklore or a legit concern?

Thanks!
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Re: Found an accurate and cheap bullet option

Postby Al in Mi » Tue Mar 14, 2017 4:16 am

engineer40 wrote:Next I think I need to try some IMR4227 and some H110 instead of Lil Gun. Hopefully I can find an accurate load with one of the alternative powders. Now that I have a cheap way to blast through a bunch of ammo with my 450BM, I'm nervous about the toll I've read that Lil Gun can take on barrels.

Do you guys think the Lil Gun burning out barrels is Internet folklore or a legit concern?

Thanks!


first I've heard of it :?
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Re: Found an accurate and cheap bullet option

Postby Hoot » Tue Mar 14, 2017 6:10 am

Al in Mi wrote:
engineer40 wrote:Next I think I need to try some IMR4227 and some H110 instead of Lil Gun. Hopefully I can find an accurate load with one of the alternative powders. Now that I have a cheap way to blast through a bunch of ammo with my 450BM, I'm nervous about the toll I've read that Lil Gun can take on barrels.

Do you guys think the Lil Gun burning out barrels is Internet folklore or a legit concern?

Thanks!


first I've heard of it :?


EDIT: Beware The Internet Factor. If 100 people are happy and 1 person is not, the 100 people leave well enough alone and never mention it. But that 1 person will make darn sure his message gets posted in as many places as possible, then it will be quoted and that's what you see. Every ball powder made will eat out a forcing cone or leade if you load it hot enough and often enough. "Everything in Moderation".

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Re: Found an accurate and cheap bullet option

Postby engineer40 » Tue Mar 14, 2017 6:38 am

If you Google "lil gun barrel erosion" you will get many pages of results with people's findings. I use Lil Gun a lot in both my 460SW Mag and my 450BM, and I do like the velocity I get while maintaining low pressure. However I might decide to sacrifice some velocity just for piece of mind if I can find an accurate load with H110 or 4227.
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Re: Found an accurate and cheap bullet option

Postby Bmt85 » Sat Mar 18, 2017 12:16 pm

That has a lot more to do with revolvers, and not all people who run revolvers at that. Some people have issues, some don't.

With lilgun in rifles, I haven't seen anything that points to faster barrel wear. A lot of people with 450bm and 300blk run it, no issues I've heard of.
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Re: Found an accurate and cheap bullet option

Postby Bmt85 » Sat Mar 18, 2017 12:41 pm

engineer40 wrote:
Bmt85 wrote:Couple of questions - What's the actual diameter of these bullets? Also, how much bearing surface do they have?

As far as crimping, I usually go .474-.476 depending on what I'm doing. Pretty sure Hoot experimented with taper crimping, and found you can go well past that (I want to say into the low .46's) and still headspace properly. Slowly take it down and thunk test each time.



The bullets are .451 diameter. I was surprised they shot so well.

I'm not sure how to answer your question on "how much bearing surface". As much as they show in the above picture?


Take a quick measure of the length of the bullet that touched the rifling.
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Re: Found an accurate and cheap bullet option

Postby Hoot » Sat Mar 18, 2017 3:50 pm

Bmt85 wrote:...snip...Pretty sure Hoot experimented with taper crimping, and found you can go well past that (I want to say into the low .46's and still headspace properly...snip


This bears mentioning every now and then:
Do not overdo it on the taper crimp on smooth sided bullets. Granted copper is softer than brass, but with nothing to drive the case mouth down into, you will wind up thinning the wall near the mouth if you overdo it on the taper crimp on smooth sided bullets. Cases aren't cheap. Its not worth compromising them. I hardly ever taper crimp on smooth sided bullets, below .476, unless they cases are already getting long in the tooth and I don't care what the result is. The test case that I took way down in diameter to satisfy my curiosity, was an empty case. If you overdo it on the crimp on a smooth sided bullet it will not spring back and you'll wind up with a projectile shaped like a domed air rifle pellet.

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