handloading 270gr Keith style SWC for Ruger American Rifle

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Re: handloading 270gr Keith style SWC for Ruger American Rif

Postby Ramson22 » Tue Sep 04, 2018 5:15 pm

shot the new shorter loading with the .454 diameter bullet accuracy was under an inch at 50yrds with an occasional flyer that would be about 4" from point of aim. All shots were measured center to center. At 100yrds the groups were 8". powder was Trail Boss @ 13.5grs velocity unknown. My best guess is that the jump to the lands is distorting the bullets by letting them enter the bore off center, resulting in junk groups after 50yrds. Ive abandoned this bullet and have decided to pursue a creating a custom mold. The process can be followed or helped along the way at http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthr ... bushmaster
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Re: handloading 270gr Keith style SWC for Ruger American Rif

Postby Al in Mi » Wed Sep 05, 2018 5:05 am

Ramson22 wrote:shot the new shorter loading with the .454 diameter bullet accuracy was under an inch at 50yrds with an occasional flyer that would be about 4" from point of aim. All shots were measured center to center. At 100yrds the groups were 8". powder was Trail Boss @ 13.5grs velocity unknown. My best guess is that the jump to the lands is distorting the bullets by letting them enter the bore off center, resulting in junk groups after 50yrds. Ive abandoned this bullet and have decided to pursue a creating a custom mold. The process can be followed or helped along the way at http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthr ... bushmaster


Just a thought here, Freebore on the 450B is spec at .453 and .200 long so I wouldn't think they be off alignment, and with accuracy being decent @ 50yds, I'd say you might need to speed them up some, for 100yd accuracy.
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Re: handloading 270gr Keith style SWC for Ruger American Rif

Postby cwlongshot » Wed Sep 05, 2018 9:33 am

Ramson22 wrote:shot the new shorter loading with the .454 diameter bullet accuracy was under an inch at 50yrds with an occasional flyer that would be about 4" from point of aim. All shots were measured center to center. At 100yrds the groups were 8". powder was Trail Boss @ 13.5grs velocity unknown. My best guess is that the jump to the lands is distorting the bullets by letting them enter the bore off center, resulting in junk groups after 50yrds. Ive abandoned this bullet and have decided to pursue a creating a custom mold. The process can be followed or helped along the way at http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthr ... bushmaster


I wouldn't be so hasty shelving this bullet. Its a proven performer.

SO MANY differences with a cast bullet... Mostly from the alloy mix and lubes. ITS UNCANNY how simply a lube change can completely change the attitude of the bullet... Then harnesses make a HUGE difference as well.

My Lyman 295G cast hard at 16BHN ish and powder coated has proven a very, very good shooter on top of IMR4227 at about 15-1600 fps. Every gun is different, as we all should know. but I would try harder and softer mixes then different lubes unless your powder coating.

If you would like I can send some of mine to you to try too..

CW
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Re: handloading 270gr Keith style SWC for Ruger American Rif

Postby Ramson22 » Thu Sep 06, 2018 4:57 pm

cwlongshot wrote:
Ramson22 wrote:shot the new shorter loading with the .454 diameter bullet accuracy was under an inch at 50yrds with an occasional flyer that would be about 4" from point of aim. All shots were measured center to center. At 100yrds the groups were 8". powder was Trail Boss @ 13.5grs velocity unknown. My best guess is that the jump to the lands is distorting the bullets by letting them enter the bore off center, resulting in junk groups after 50yrds. Ive abandoned this bullet and have decided to pursue a creating a custom mold. The process can be followed or helped along the way at http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthr ... bushmaster


I wouldn't be so hasty shelving this bullet. Its a proven performer.

SO MANY differences with a cast bullet... Mostly from the alloy mix and lubes. ITS UNCANNY how simply a lube change can completely change the attitude of the bullet... Then harnesses make a HUGE difference as well.

My Lyman 295G cast hard at 16BHN ish and powder coated has proven a very, very good shooter on top of IMR4227 at about 15-1600 fps. Every gun is different, as we all should know. but I would try harder and softer mixes then different lubes unless your powder coating.

If you would like I can send some of mine to you to try too..

CW

Thanks, I only powder coat bullets, I do think my load is about 1700fps with the 13.5grs of trailboss. SAAMI shows that the chamber has a long free-bore with a diameter of 0.4530. Long free bores cause shaving of lead and miss alignment. with the small nose diameter on this bullet it has more than enough opportunity to become distorted or miss aligned. My bullets were hard enough, that I could only cause a tiny dent that was more of a scratch, with my thumb nail. That should be more than hard enough. also hard HP's fragment rather than expanding, which is not ideal.
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Re: handloading 270gr Keith style SWC for Ruger American Rif

Postby Ramson22 » Thu Sep 06, 2018 5:05 pm

I'm going to do a chamber impact impression as part of the process of designing a mold, this should reveal how well the Keith bullet fit.
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Re: handloading 270gr Keith style SWC for Ruger American Rif

Postby Al in Mi » Fri Sep 07, 2018 3:52 am

I do like that bullet you guys came up with on Cast Boolits. Would there be any benefit to adding a gas check for those who like to drive things hard?? ;)
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Re: handloading 270gr Keith style SWC for Ruger American Rif

Postby cwlongshot » Fri Sep 07, 2018 8:31 am

Ransome,

If you can mark a lead bullet at all, it isn't considered a hard bullet. Its probably not even a 10 BHN. That's fine, but not the best choice for a rifle bullet. The 450 isn't super high pressure, but it is high for a cast bullet and at the speeds over 14-1500fps you really see the benefits of a harder bullet.

I shoot allot of 40's cast at 10/11 BHN and they are fine to about 25 yards. but for my use PLATE shooting, this is fine as I don't generally ever see a 25 yard target. But when I got my AR in 40, for PCC matches can see 50 Yard targets and I do not get the accuracy needed for a 4" plate using this harness bullet. I cast them harder at 15-16 and my accuracy returns to sub 2" at 50 yards. (Touching when benched)

My 450 Bullets are all cast at least this hard, then Powder coated. I see clover leafs regularly at 50 and 1-1.75" 100 yard groups with most any loading. Sometimes slightly better. I have used Trail Boss as well as 1680 & 4227 powders and all shot well.

CW
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Re: handloading 270gr Keith style SWC for Ruger American Rif

Postby Ramson22 » Sat Sep 08, 2018 1:50 am

Al in Mi wrote:I do like that bullet you guys came up with on Cast Boolits. Would there be any benefit to adding a gas check for those who like to drive things hard?? ;)

Depends on how fast you are going to shoot them. A 330gr projectile at 2000fps has 2932 foot pounds of energy at the muzzle. I have not pushed powder coating this fast, however there are others who have and say that a gas check is not needed. I would think that a gas check would be requried, however when I get that mold I'm going to try for 2000fps with the plain based powder coated bullet.
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Re: handloading 270gr Keith style SWC for Ruger American Rif

Postby Al in Mi » Sat Sep 08, 2018 5:11 am

Typically I'm a NHRA mash the gas full throttle gas on guy that's why I was asking on the GC!!!! Years ago I use to cast for all my big bore handguns, but don't shoot near as much as I use to, but still have the equipment collecting dust someplace.

I'd be interested in buying some when you get ready, never played with powder coated bullets.
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Re: handloading 270gr Keith style SWC for Ruger American Rif

Postby cwlongshot » Sat Sep 08, 2018 7:18 am

Absolutely correct PC dosent replace a GC!

BUT, its better then a Plain Base Lead Bullet!

If you throw a PC bullet back in the pot, you will see all
Lead melt out of the PC “shell” the shell will remain with most of its color, sitting atop the moltem lead, after the lead is melted.

I have read many times that 3K is within the realm
Of a PC’d bullet. Personally 2k is plenty for me and even that is more than my bullets will see. This Caliber is about the fastest velocity I have shot PC bullets.

BUT. We all should know its not just the heat that a bullet have to deal with and the pressure of a given load is a bigger contributor to base errosion.

AL, PM me an address, Ill send you a couple varietys to try!

CW
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