FTX Bullets Comparison

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Re: FTX Bullets Comparison

Postby Hoot » Thu Apr 21, 2011 12:40 pm

This is exasperating. :roll:
We have an index and I put a lot of work into This Thread. Too bad it is down umpteen pages from the top now.

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Re: FTX Bullets Comparison

Postby Jim in Houston » Fri Apr 22, 2011 5:25 pm

It is sometimes exasperating to find things in the right thread (or to find the right thread). Maybe better titling, like "Reloading with the 225 gr FTX" would help? :-)

Not as snappy, but more explanatory of the content. Anyway, many thanks for the link to the 225 data and results of Hoot's testing. I am getting better at finding things, but I agree that there are related items scattered among different threads and duplicate threads covering the same or similar subjects. Maybe they can be resorted?

BTW on the Hornady offer, just call them and ask about the availability of the Bushmaster 450 .452 cal 250 gr FTX bullet - #45201. I had to pay $5 per box to offset the additional cost of the bullets over those in the offer plus shipping ($14.95, if I remember). I talked to Kelsey, who asked me to write in the number and description at the bottom of the list on the 2011 Get Loaded offer form, which you can find at http://www.hornady.com/promotions/get-loaded. The offer is good from Jan 1 to the end of the year, so if you bought dies or reloading equipment in 2011, you should be eligible.
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Re: FTX Bullets Comparison

Postby Jim in Houston » Sat Jun 11, 2011 3:57 pm

This should probably go in the 225 FTX Going the Other Way thread, but when I try to post there, I keep getting kicked out. Also, that thread does not appear in the Forum index.

Anyway, my question is, after all of the discussion and the data on the 225 FTX bullet, is there a final consensus on the loading data - what type powder, how much, and how to crimp with the canneleurs. These bullets are a lot cheaper than the 250 gr and I would like to load them, if it can be done safely and they work in the Bushmaster 450.
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Re: FTX Bullets Comparison

Postby nickdeannow » Mon Apr 08, 2013 8:42 pm

I just thought I would share my most recent data and successes with the 225 FTX bullet...

I loved the 450 bushmaster from the moment I shot my first 5 rounds from it. Then I discovered this forum, which really got my attention with the thought I could be just as accurate, but shoot this caliber at a third the cost by 'rolling my own.'

Based on Hoot's analysis I knew that the 225 FTX was going to be at the foundation of my development. I came to this conclusion because he was able to produce tight groups, but primarily because of the economics (I'm a bit of a tight wad.)

Initially, I was determined to standardize on H110 as that was the powder I had used previously for: 357mag., .44mag., and .460S&W.

I believe I started as low as 36gr loads with H110 and worked my way up in half grain steps and the best repeatable results I could achieve we're at 41gr. This was on average only slightly better than a 2.5" group. While this is completely acceptable for mid-west deer hunting, I was highly disappointed I could not achieve the results I had been reading about on here.

That said I started questioning everything I was doing... Being an engineer, my processes proceeded to verge on the edge of rediculous! I won't go into the detail of my sickness, but I'll just say that calling me 'anal' doesn't begin to describe the amount of time I spent to isolate the potential variables.

When I started reloading the 450b, the only primers I could find were federal match primers. From everything I read they seemed to be 'ok', but there was always that question. To say the least, I was jumping out of my chair in the office after I had procured 1,000 WSR primers and had 10 different recipes loaded up for test after work...

Unfortunately my bubble was burst when the WSR primers produced almost identical results to the Federal primers I had been playing with. It broke my heart and I began to accept defeat over factory ammo that ALWAYS delivered no worse than1.5" groups...On a bad day!

Last month I gave in and decided to buy some of this Lil'Gun powder everyone was using and see if it would yield any different results. Well here is where my story turns to the positive. And by positive I mean doing gay cart wheels and dancing for joy! Ok...Maybe I wasn't that excited, but it was pretty darn close.

Based on everything I read, 38gr of Lil'Gun was a great place to start. I loaded 10 ea. @ 38, 39, 38.5, 39, & 39.5 with Lil'Gun and WSR primers through a 20" barrel. Also, I taper crimped everything to .474.

In the end, I was absolutely blown away by the accuracy improvements that came from my switch to Lil'Gun! While my best accuracy (as Hoot previously demonstrates) came at 38gr of charge, all loads were better than the H110 loads I had been working with.

I know Hoot speaks of another accuracy node coming in around 41gr of LilGun for his 20" barrel, but I am so freakin' happy with multiple 1.1" 5 shot groups that I don't want to experiment anymore. I'm done...This round has given me far more than I would've EVER expected!!!!!!

Sorry I don't have paper target pictures to reinforce my bliss. I do have some at home to share, but I'm traveling on business this week. In fact, I'm in NYC trying not to draw attention to myself amongst all the wackjobs! (I can't believe my iPad thinks "wackjob" is a real word.)
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Re: FTX Bullets Comparison

Postby nickdeannow » Mon Apr 08, 2013 8:59 pm

Just one small note to those who are analyzing the impact of various primers: I will mention that the WSR primers used in identical loads resulted in a point of impact that averaged right at .7" higher than the identical load using federal 205M primers.
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Re: FTX Bullets Comparison

Postby Hoot » Tue Apr 09, 2013 11:57 am

nickdeannow wrote:Just one small note to those who are analyzing the impact of various primers: I will mention that the WSR primers used in identical loads resulted in a point of impact that averaged right at .7" higher than the identical load using federal 205M primers.


Change in velocity = Change in OBT. Also good reading is OCW

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Re: FTX Bullets Comparison

Postby Jim in Houston » Wed Apr 10, 2013 8:52 am

Jim in Houston wrote:This should probably go in the 225 FTX Going the Other Way thread, but when I try to post there, I keep getting kicked out. Also, that thread does not appear in the Forum index.

Anyway, my question is, after all of the discussion and the data on the 225 FTX bullet, is there a final consensus on the loading data - what type powder, how much, and how to crimp with the canneleurs. These bullets are a lot cheaper than the 250 gr and I would like to load them, if it can be done safely and they work in the Bushmaster 450.


Here is how I am now loading my 225 FTX rounds:
    38 gr Lil Gun
    Taper Crimp in the cannelure to .475 (I am also going to try a stab crimp in the cannelure with a taper crimp above the cannelure, if there is enough space before the ogive)
    COL 2.150 (approx - what you get when crimped into the cannelure)
    WSR primers (preferred, but others may work)
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Re: FTX Bullets Comparison

Postby BD1 » Sun Apr 14, 2013 6:11 pm

The biggest single improvement in accuracy I made with the 225 grainers came when I decided to ignore the cannelure, and seated them out to 2.260 just like the 250s, with a waist crimp, (stab crimp?). They easily stay moa to 200 yards. At 300 yards the groups open up a bit more, but I've yet to try them on a perfectly calm day. They definitely blow around a little more than the 250s. These days my seating die stays set to the same sweet spot for all of the pointy bullets. The COAL winds up a little shorter with the 225s, but the critical diameter on the ogive is were it needs to be.
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Re: FTX Bullets Comparison

Postby wildcatter » Mon Apr 15, 2013 6:35 am

BD1 wrote:The biggest single improvement in accuracy I made with the 225 grainers came when I decided to ignore the cannelure, and seated them out to 2.260 just like the 250s, with a waist crimp, (stab crimp?). They easily stay moa to 200 yards. At 300 yards the groups open up a bit more, but I've yet to try them on a perfectly calm day. They definitely blow around a little more than the 250s. These days my seating die stays set to the same sweet spot for all of the pointy bullets. The COAL winds up a little shorter with the 225s, but the critical diameter on the ogive is were it needs to be.
BD


Ya got this Right.

Back in the Calgun Days I tried to get the guys to just reload for performance by seating the bullets out to fit the mag and forget the cannellure. I lost that argument. Seating the bullet out, to it's max OAL (it's got to be safe and logical .125" may not be enough in the case for most missions) has many benefits that can be exploited..

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Re: FTX Bullets Comparison

Postby Jim in Houston » Mon Apr 15, 2013 2:30 pm

BD1 wrote:The biggest single improvement in accuracy I made with the 225 grainers came when I decided to ignore the cannelure, and seated them out to 2.260 just like the 250s, with a waist crimp, (stab crimp?). . . . These days my seating die stays set to the same sweet spot for all of the pointy bullets. The COAL winds up a little shorter with the 225s, but the critical diameter on the ogive is were it needs to be.
BD


Great info. Thanks very much. I have just reloaded a few taper crimped in the cannelure to .475. The COL was about 2.110 in this configuration. Next batch will crimp to 2.25 COL taper alone and taper plus stab. Will compare and post the results, when I have them.
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