DANGEROUS LOADING PRACTICES

Talk about your 450b reloading experience, ask questions, etc...

Moderator: MudBug

Forum rules
Please try and keep it safe!

This information is the responsibility of the community, not the forum. 450bushmaster.net is not responsible if you blow yourselves up.

Re: DANGEROUS LOADING PRACTICES

Postby Gifters » Wed Dec 05, 2018 6:44 pm

So... speaking of dangerous loading practices and not wanting to start a new thread or search back beyond, I figure Hoot will probably read this and offer insight. Shot just a few rounds before packing everything up for deer camp tomorrow. Only 2 of my hand loads that were .4990 for case head while the One round of the factory Hornady Black measured .5030 . I'm dumbfounded, that seems really over presure since it was a new round (possibly thin case walls at the head?) but yeah that case needs to get tossed! anybody else experience factory ammo that bad. BTW I had one factory Hornady round pushing 2475 out of the chrono... I'm guessing it was that one.
Gifters
 
Posts: 15
Joined: Wed Aug 02, 2017 7:11 am

Re: DANGEROUS LOADING PRACTICES

Postby Hoot » Wed Dec 05, 2018 7:34 pm

Gifters wrote:So... speaking of dangerous loading practices and not wanting to start a new thread or search back beyond, I figure Hoot will probably read this and offer insight. Shot just a few rounds before packing everything up for deer camp tomorrow. Only 2 of my hand loads that were .4990 for case head while the One round of the factory Hornady Black measured .5030 . I'm dumbfounded, that seems really over presure since it was a new round (possibly thin case walls at the head?) but yeah that case needs to get tossed! anybody else experience factory ammo that bad. BTW I had one factory Hornady round pushing 2475 out of the chrono... I'm guessing it was that one.


Loads with starch in their undies are not the only cause of excessive Case Head Growth. My first 450b (Bushmaster) had a loosey goosey chamber. It was great for feeding just about anything reliably but even mild loads sustained more CHG than anyone else on the forum was experiencing for the same recipe. If that wasn't bad enough, the looseness also allowed the cases to shrink in length quite a bit for the first 2-3 firings before they settled down. It was not unusual to see them go from 1.697 new to 1.679! I've read here of other members having experience occasional excessive CHG with factory loads. Like you, they were at a loss as to why. Your guess of thin wall is as good as any. Hardness can also be a contributing factor. Starline brass is thinner walled than Hornady but they are a harder brass alloy and as such, don't sustain any greater CHG than the Hornady brass do. If anything, they sustain a little less per firing. If after resizing, you can still get them to pass the "Thunk Test" keep using them. As soon as they stop falling all the way in without needing help, toss them. The only thing worse than having to stop on the firing line to tap out a spent case with a cleaning rod, is to have a failure to feed far enough to lock the action while needing a followup shot when hunting. Mass production manufacturing will allow occasional cases that fall outside of some spec to sneak through. If the other factory loads from that box do not do the same thing, you just write it off to bum luck and add the bad ones to the recycling box. Some scrap metal recyclers will take deprimed cartridge brass and some won't. A rare few will take them with the spent primers still in them.

I always set aside a handful of new brass, that are the same length, to make up my hunting loads from. Its a lot cheaper than the cost of the hunting trip. ;)

Hoot
In Theory, there is no difference between theory and practice. In Practice, there is.
User avatar
Hoot
 
Posts: 4436
Joined: Tue Feb 09, 2010 9:34 am
Location: Minnesota

Re: DANGEROUS LOADING PRACTICES

Postby Gifters » Thu Dec 06, 2018 1:00 pm

This is the only case with CHG out of spec from the 100 or so I've shot and loaded and shot again. And this was a factory load. So I don't believe its my chamber since its a unicorn so far. Does have a slight bend in the case rim so I'll just drill a hole in the case wall and keep it as a reminder.

I"ve been really impressed with starline bras so far, a couple are a hair shorter but weighing powder twice and everything, most loads are within a .05 of a grain if that.
Gifters
 
Posts: 15
Joined: Wed Aug 02, 2017 7:11 am

Re: DANGEROUS LOADING PRACTICES

Postby bebop » Sun Apr 28, 2019 4:19 am

Hi y'all!

Good thread! I'm still waiting for my Mossberg Patriot in 450 Bushmaster to be delivered overseas. I managed to find a dealer selling Lil gun and have bought 4 cases of powder, 2 bags of Starline brass and a lot of bullets (mostly Hornady FTX 250 grain but also 300 gr XTP MAG and Speer Deep curl 300 gr). Primers; I guess I'll use standard CCI small rifle.

So now the question:
I'm not planning to blow myself up!!
My goal is to produce a safe load in my bolt action that have at least 1500 ft lb energy at 100 yards (due to local regulations) with the 250 grainers and of course as good precision I can get. I have the Lee dies and if I understand correctly, crimping is maybe better to skip if I don't need to right?

I'll start with the published loads from Hornady and carefully work my way up, but do you guys have any suggestions besides that? As I said, anything above 1500 ft lb at a hunnert yards is fine. I do own a chrono and QL.

Greetings from Sweden!
bebop
 
Posts: 7
Joined: Wed Mar 27, 2019 5:09 am

Re: DANGEROUS LOADING PRACTICES

Postby Hoot » Sun Apr 28, 2019 6:24 am

CCI Small Rifle primers would not be my first choice for consistent precision but I understand that you can only buy products that are offered in your area. If there are other CCI products, consider the CCI 450 instead. Greater brillance for more consistent ignition. If US brands of primers are available, consider the Remingron 7 1/2 or Winchester WSR. Definitely do not use CCI BR4 primers. They were my very first 450b reloading choice I made because I already had them. The resultant performance had high velocity SD and high velocity SD is already a challenge in this caliber, under the best circumstances.

Hoot
In Theory, there is no difference between theory and practice. In Practice, there is.
User avatar
Hoot
 
Posts: 4436
Joined: Tue Feb 09, 2010 9:34 am
Location: Minnesota

Re: DANGEROUS LOADING PRACTICES

Postby bebop » Sun Apr 28, 2019 6:41 am

Thanks!

The store I usually buy stuff from have the Remington primers in stock, but only one 100 pack left.
Federal primers any good?
bebop
 
Posts: 7
Joined: Wed Mar 27, 2019 5:09 am

Re: DANGEROUS LOADING PRACTICES

Postby Texas Sheepdawg » Sun Apr 28, 2019 7:18 pm

bebop wrote:Thanks!

The store I usually buy stuff from have the Remington primers in stock, but only one 100 pack left.
Federal primers any good?


You could also try CCI #41 small rifle military primers. They are a bit harder and hotter and designed for the 5.56 NATO round.
I’ve used them for all of my 450 Bushmasters.
-Texas Sheepdawg
Join us on FaceBook https://www.facebook.com/groups/Texas.Sheepdawg.Patriots/
http://youtube.com/c/TexasSheepdawg21
NRA Life Member
User avatar
Texas Sheepdawg
 
Posts: 4242
Joined: Fri Nov 05, 2010 10:55 am
Location: North Texas

Re: DANGEROUS LOADING PRACTICES

Postby bebop » Mon Apr 29, 2019 1:38 pm

Went to the store today and the best primers they had in stock was the CCI 450. Bought a couple of hundred of those.
Those primers and 25.5 grains of Li'l Gun for the Hornady FTX 250gr as the manual says should be a good starting point right?

Crimp or no crimp?
bebop
 
Posts: 7
Joined: Wed Mar 27, 2019 5:09 am

Re: DANGEROUS LOADING PRACTICES

Postby Hoot » Mon Apr 29, 2019 9:17 pm

bebop wrote:Went to the store today and the best primers they had in stock was the CCI 450. Bought a couple of hundred of those.
Those primers and 25.5 grains of Li'l Gun for the Hornady FTX 250gr as the manual says should be a good starting point right?

Crimp or no crimp?


I think you got your first digit of the charge weight wrong. I would advise starting at 36gr and working up from there in half grain increments. My AR variant with 20" barrel hits factory 250gr FTX spec at 37gr and a COL of 2.26. Taper crimped to .475-.476 measured carefully, as close to the mouth as possible. With a bolt action, you can go a lot further, but I know for certain that the above recipe is safe and effective. Once you feel confident with those loads, then consider working up to take advantage of the extra strength of your bolt action. We love range reports, especially with pictures. ;)

Hoot
In Theory, there is no difference between theory and practice. In Practice, there is.
User avatar
Hoot
 
Posts: 4436
Joined: Tue Feb 09, 2010 9:34 am
Location: Minnesota

Re: DANGEROUS LOADING PRACTICES

Postby bebop » Mon Apr 29, 2019 10:47 pm

Thanks Hoot!
I double checked in another reloading manual and that one said to start at 34 grain, a third manual said 35 grain.
The confusing bit with the 450BM is that tables are not consistent and manufacturers seems to not have fully tested it.
I'll post range reports when I have then!
bebop
 
Posts: 7
Joined: Wed Mar 27, 2019 5:09 am

PreviousNext

Return to Reloading for the 450b

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 6 guests